NWN 2: Sundren Persistent World

Sundren, a Neverwinter Nights 2 persistent world, sent along some great news about their creation:

The Sundren development team's goal is to provide and support the best persistent world experience in Neverwinter Nights 2. The group is comprised of creative and technical talent with experience of "modding" numerous games, dedicated to delivering in a timely fashion high-quality content.

See our gallery: http://www.sundren.org/photoplog/

Sundren is a fictional land located South of Icewind Dale in the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting for Dungeons & Dragons. For indepth information on Sundren, please visit our wiki. Although a roleplay server by nature, Sundren prides itself on a diverse balance of playstyles. In Sundren, group/party exploration is encouraged and at most times necessary to accomplish a given goal. Sundren's key style is between Dungeon Master Events & Interaction, as well as detailed rich areas with scripted quests. Player versus Player Combat (PvP) is also possible on the server, with only a few rules in order to prevent griefing and/or abuse.

Sundren has a diverse featureset, here a few things that make Sundren unique.

* Completely Custom loot drop system which actually generates items and uses a colour code system to determine their rarity. This system uses an entire database that stores every item in the game. Sundren's loot system is by far the most robust and diverse system of its kind ever made in Neverwinter Nights 1 or 2.

* Unique faction system saves your faction standing with various groups in Sundren. Quest to gain influence with different factions to get access to unique stores and/or items.

* Special ingame tools like a character deleter, and future additions include a description editor.

* Unique experience system which punishes grinders but benefits groups of players and roleplayers

* Tons of custom scripting that spice up gameplay, such as environmental hazards

* Want to use social skills in more than just DMFI dicerolls? NPCs in Sundren employ use of many skills in conversations

* A highly balanced, constantly evolving economy that achieves harmony between crafting, stores, and loot drops to provide a unique but challenging experience

* Our server is an enterprise class rackmount HP Proliant for maximum performance and uptime.

* Tired of constantly downloading PWC files? Updating your game to play on Sundren is a snap with our custom-built inhouse Sundren Updater!

Here's a few other things Sundren has.

* DMFI with Languages
* Superior DM interaction with PnP style gameplay
* Fishing
* NWN2 crafting (modified to fit Sundren's economy, with overpowered items removed, and custom recipes added)
* Unique death system which makes death undesirable, but not character-breaking
* Custom resting to add more challenge to dungeon crawling, and prevent abuse
* Dozens of unique stores and items to fit almost every class
* Weather
* Templates such as a Vampire (DM-given only)
* Various small gameplay changes, such as a knockdown cooldown timer

* New updates almost daily based on community feedback

What could Sundren possibly be missing? Only you can help us with that. Sundren evolves based on its community feedback which all our developers take to heart.

Sundren features work from some of the most talented mappers in Neverwinter Nights 2. Don't believe us? Check it out for yourself.

Email: saulus@sundren.org

Permalink

Server is really disappointing. Firstly, they've stuffed up the death system where the cleric is the one who loses out 15k gold out of their own pocket to raise the dead - at the cleric's expense. The players themselves (majority) are too established in their own buddy groups and you're not welcome into those groups.. so really you've only got yourself to rely on.

They make you feel like such an outsider.. regardless what help your character has done for them, its quickly forgotten (because your not in their buddy network).. and the admins/gm's for the most part (most of them) are childish and don't think things through for the long-term. I didn't like the way the server was going or with how i was treated in most cases after i went out of my way to help out people (those same people who forgot how much i'd done for them) and when i decide to delete my character and account, the admin throws a sulk and instead of letting me just up and leave, - bans the account.

Honestly, if you're sick of the clicky groups you find on most game servers and sick of the way people talk around you and ignore you so they can hear their 'friends' only. (also gm's seem to favor their game player friends over the rest) - then I'd strongly suggest you find a different server - this isn't worth the grief!!!

Ha! I'm not the only one. i actually bothered to register here just to reply to this this post about that crap server.
Dude, I'm going to totally agree with you there because I was with the server for about 2 months myself and it was really a waste of my time and effort.
I've never felt more alone in a 'social group' evironment as i did in that place. There were a few events i tried to participate in and when I spoke to the group I may as well have not written anything at all. They completely ignored everything I had said and continued to talk around me.
I got banned from the server because my character was bugged. - Yeah you heard me!

My character kept getting gold nonstop and I had reported this to one of their bigger GM's ; GodbeastX. Who at first completely ignored me, then eventually after about 6-7 messages to him over like 5 days told me to find another Gm to deal with it because he was too lazy to be bothered. So I gave up after the others didn't bother to lift a finger and deal with it.
At a later point - cos I had just given up trying to do the right thing - I had a GM (One that I had tried to speak about this earlier, suddenly take notice and went on about how I was using a bug and abusing it and (this is the same gold issue) I was going against all their rules and so on.
Before I could even tell that fuckwit that I _had_ reported it and those lazy cunts couldn't be bothered responding to me, he banned my account. Their all a pack of self-righteous assholes who do fuck all listening and seem to enjoy proclaiming everyone scammers and not bothering to actually understand that people do try and do the right thing but their too short-term memory orientated and too lazy to listen to anyone but themselves.

So yeah - in agreement.. the Sundren Server is not work the time or effort to anyone.

Interesting to see that other people have thoughts about this server in a similar manner that I did. Judging by what I've read and my own personal experience with the server, I reckon these are the sort of things players need to be aware of prior joining a server.

I had joined Sundren less than a year ago and I was rather impressed by the map structure and the roleplay environment. However, a good map and an intense roleplaying community aren't what make a server good. I was in what you said wolfecub. the "IN" crowd. Although it was fun to participate with a social group, I was very much disappointed how they treated new people to the server and how self-absorbed they really were with themselves.
Myself, I'm a little bit of a rogue. I like to try and keep in a social group, but I also like to go out of my way to help new people and make them feel welcome and know that there is at least one person who is willing to go out of their way to help others even at my own expense.
The other people in my crowd couldn't really be bothered with doing that. Because of my wandering off to do this for other players, my own crowd shunned me. *shows you who your friends really are*

So I thought I'd leave the server for a few months until we had more crowds and different people. I announced it on the forums and up and left for a while. I came back a few months later - I had been refreshing the account. Player I think for a little over an hour and then got booted.
When I was trying to figure out why, I tried to relog back in, thinking it was just one of the many crashes that server has - to find out that my account has been blocked.
Now, I didn't do anything at all, have no idea why that had happened and when I tried to go onto the vent channel to ask why, I was kicked off that too hearing in the background "its that asshole, just kick him mike he's a wasted case here" and i was banned off vent.

My guess is that some of the in-crowd I was with still played and had obviously been either sucking up to the staff and befriended some, or been sleeping with them...

in either case, the response to my email from one of the staff as to what was the reason to my banning was pathetic. QUOTE: Some players don't want you around because your not the sort of person we want playing here. I only think I can say that may have attributed to part of this, was my post on a top 100 nwn2 server website where I said that sundren needs a lot of work in player interaction and the staff need to stop taking sides with their friends over people who are loners.

Goes to show how childish they can really be. Ohh, on an afterthought. I've noticed that the sundren staff like to delete negative comments written by players and critics alike, even when its on a factual point that they can't deny. Yet keep the positive points people write on any site mentioning them - trying to pretend their better then they are.

Both points should be available to all prospecting players, not what they want people to believe/read.

This was probably a waste of time writing because if I'm right, this and your comments guys will be removed and some geek will write something like "I luv this server" and it'll stay on.

My conclusion? - Do not play this server and develop your character on a more welcoming host.

Originally I joined to play and join a community. After all this crap though with the last 30 minutes of my gametime on that shithole, I'm frankly here to cause a bad review damage to the server.
It really does suck when everything I had said is true and I was more than willing to leave the server with my final work of - *cuts throat, deletes character/and account* and not come back without any further action.
Instead they rub salt in the wound of unhappy playing by booting me, then banning me.

My original intention after the fuck up they did with clerics was to play my rogue a while - (chaotic evil duegar dwarf who was cynical, sarcastic and outright rude). Then do a wind down and leave.
As it happened, they crashed my account so the guy i'd just pickpocketed could catch up to me (only my account funnily enough and non one elrses) as well as the gm in the npc clothing and a few others... Meted out a penalty (cutting off my guys hand) and when they killed me, immediately booted me from the server.
I found that as a complete insult.. that wasn't roleplaying, that was what you get from many other servers where they goat over power as to how they can either make or break ur character and imply their control over one's account..
Crashing a players login to do what they wanted without his knowledge, then booting them is bullshit.
I was going to tell them that in the forum for my goodbye post and guess what?
Pretty much as soon as they booted me and blocked my account off the server, they had immediately banned my forum account. Their really fucked - they get the last word, another power trip.
I hope their server burns to be honest. They added insult to injury and now its my turn to be as honest about my experience with the server as I have been and make sure no other player goes through the same grief and shit that I've gone through. (obviously you guys as well).
The only positive replies i reckon you'll get here will be from people still playing and in those established clicky groups.
They silence everyone else.

Thank you for the heads up. I'll give the sundren server a wide birth. Can you suggest any that are fairly good? I've played a few but have noticed a lot of them are similar to what you people have been talking about.

Ilsa's Adult haven *you need to be 18+* is a very friendly server, although they don't actually have a lot to do there. There's a few places to visit and the role play is laid back. But the people are friendly. Otherwise the other one i've been on has been Legends of Arcadia. Its actually a nice server and doesn't crash all that much.

last post from me on this - but the jerk who runs sundren after my email i sent him about how screwed up his server was, sent the email to my isp abuse team. I've phoned them and told them as to what was going on and they have heard both sides of it and considered my email not abusive but offensively written. However, its unbelievable the length this jerk goes too.

Avoid the server - or you could get this same treatment. I've had my say, the word is out.. see what happens when you put up a criticism and you get all this crap back?

He contacted your isp? thats kind of getting a little personal isn't it?

I hope I'm not prying, but what did you write?

*cut and pasted*

just going to say two things....

first, there's no point playing there because everyone's in this buddy network and it destroys the approachability of the game to be introduced to new people. Secondly, i deleted axel originally because that whole change over with the death system is fucked.

That was NOT thought out. Why does the cleric have to be the one who has to pay for some fuckhead who gets killed? or in passing you raise them at your expense and they lose fuck all over it. Whata load of bullshit.

The whole banning me off forums was fucking childish which goes to show the schooling capacity of the gm's involved. So due to that.. i'm going to do whatever possible now to advertise what a hole this place is... that was just pathetic with the way it was handled.

that was not abuse. That was just a statement with a fair bit of swearing. Although the bit at the end about splashing negative remarks about his server could be taken as a threat.
If what you meant is based on anything you wrote at the top of this thread then I don't see any problem or abuse.

Just an x-players perspective or the negative experience they had on that particular server. Sending that email to your isp's abuse line was just a cruel and pointless endeavour where he's proving that he can be a prick. It also proving you all right about whats in your posts.

Seems to me nothing has changed on that server. Your email wasn't abusive though but I have noticed you've posted that same first post of this thread on a lot of other NWN2 servers that even mention Sundren so that is spamming and a little overkill.
But I do reckon what you've said makes sense coming from both from my experience and a few other people's.

Difference is, I left quietly - after my rant - and your going out of your way to run them down. Because of that, your are getting more attention from them and are probably going to try and inflict more damage on you for it.

But I will say good on you though. Because you're right. People really do need to be aware how servers are run and need to know this information. I've been on games where they make players >> Gm's - who then have grudges on co-players and go out of their way to grieve. I've had gm's who get power and abuse it and because that person is staff, the guy who offered him the role - doesn't want to be seen employing bad staff - so therefore its the player at fault to save administration face.

Its not just on Sundren but a lot of servers - mostly those that are privately owned. I have been in everyone one of those situations and still cannot believe how they try and make you the one who is at fault when most of the time its them.

All i'm going to say is don't let it get to you. You've had a say on a lot of nwn2 host sites - and it might be an idea to not let this get out of hand.

just friendly advice.

If you want funny, they deleted a whole post section on http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=nwn2gameworlds.Detail&id=99 (--- NWN2 Vaults -

which seems to be the bigger host site that they use. Even got to the point of actually contacting the admin of the site host to block it so people couldn't comment about the server at all.
Apparently they don't like people writing negative reviews - ie - my response email from the admin;

--------------

Hey there,

Please do make any further posts on any pages
for Sundren, whether it's news, gameworlds listings or
anything else they might submit.

You've expressed your feelings about them but continuing
to post negative comments is a violation of our site policy
which will result in a ban if ignored

--------------------------

So that site now doesn't have the warning to players about what to expect. I don't know if nwn2 vaults cares that their advertising a site that is both deceitful and flourishes with liars, or if they just look at the cash - if its a paysite - and ignore the fact that they'll host anyone, good or bad. In the long run though, too many bad servers will catch up with them and perhaps popularity might disintergrate. If they support those sort of sites without looking into it or caring about the grievances players have experienced - then thats not my problem.
He responded to me, but it was basically more inclined to one of those "I just want to remain oblivious to your concerns and plod along as i have been."

Not to mention - and finally mention for this post, I wrote what I wrote for this first thread, then another comment. I had one response from a gm of that server saying that I wrote a ton of emails to them all containing abuse and how I used coarse language and had bad behaviour, abused dm's in game, harassed people, broke rules, etc etc etc..

I responded saying that their full of crap - even got my isp noted that i only sent out one email - the one you've read above - and the rest of it was lies just for them to make-believe I was a problem case.

I've actually written a long email - to the NWN2 vaults guy who i believe just skimmed it and shrugged it off - about the whole thing. That reply in this post from his was his response to that.

So really, they just don't care.

Note: I'm also saving each and every one of everyone's posts here just to make sure I've got this all recorded if it comes to anything bad. Also the fact since that NWN2 host deleted one direct confirmation of corruption of their gm's post with the lies about my intervention in the game. Rather pissed about that because it was good hard evidence that they'll say anything and lie to make a player seem like their the disruption.

Here's that email i sent to the nwn2 vaults guy, sorry that its long;

-----------------------------

I've read what you've had to say,but I need to point out a few things that
you may or may not be aware of.

Firstly, I was initionally was only going to do the one post. My experiece
of Sundren began all right with the good-sized map and the intense roleplay.
But as i continued to play, I started realising how the people there - were
for the most part - established in their own clique groups worked in their
own networks and pretty much shunned those outside the network.

As I continued to play I felt more and more alone. I could never find
friends to do go and do things with. I had initially gone out of my way to
use my higher level cleric get people xp so they could stand on their own
two feet and escort them about in my own time and at my expense (losing XP
so they get it to enable them to stand on their own two feet).

Players - for the most part - were so self-absorbed in their established
sub-communities made one feel more than a little isolated. The really sad
thing is, in my early gameplaying days with some people there, I became
known as a very helpful and useful player to have around.

Its funny how quickly that was all forgotten when I served my purpose and
how "intense" roleplaying turned into "selective" roleplay. They remembered
things when they could be bothered too and only listened to what their
friends said over what anyone else said to establish an rp story.

I've lost count the amount of times that myself and a few other new faces
have put in a comment or two trying to involve ourselves into an event or
scenario to just be spoken around or completely ignored.

It was only in the last week that I didn't see playing there any point. So i
was going to start a wind down. My first initial disappointment was that the
admin and gm's had changed the death system. I understand as admins they can
do that and I can understand that - yes - it did need to be harsher because
people were taking death for granted.

However, as a player I believe I had a right to point out a few points they
may have overlooked. Firsty, they rigged it so if another player dies,
raising them from the dead - would be at the clerics expense. The dead
player gains a lot from this and the cleric - who's doing the service - is
ultimately (time and time again) the one taking the heavy losses.

**************

But that's all by the by... basically I initially just wanted to leave
quietly. I point out the fact that it was useless being a cleric now, so I
deleted mine. Ended up playing my rogue for a while till yesterday when they
banned me.

The fact is, I was going to leave peacefully and they turned the whole
incident from a simple up and leaving, into a personal sulk fit.

The last message - after I died, that only the DM's would have read - was
*cuts own throat* (as the rp finale) and "deletes character/closes account"

Instead of just letting me leave, they had to add insult to injury by
booting my character. Then add a further insult by banning me off forrum
immediately after the boot (yeah I found that out when I was about to write
my goodbye post).

So of course I was infuriated by this and sent an email to the admin.

(Not to mention any place I found a sundren advertisement I posted my bad
experience with the server and the points of those experiences).

I don't want people to go through what I had to experience. People who
respond like that and a community who are - at the baseline - snobs, don't
deserve false publicity of pretending that their great. Its both misleading
and unhealthy.

There were very, very few people who were friendly and those who were I had
no problem going about with. But on the community scale those were very,
very few.

I wasn't happy with my experience there - and there's a lot more too it that
would take too long to write up, but I'm more than up to doing it if i have
too. So I wanted to make sure that the public were aware as to what they
were getting into.

BUT... they have taken this further. They've attacked me PERSONALLY now, by
contacting my ISP about an email I sent the admin. I've spoken to my isp
support team and they read the email I said and;

I quote: "the email I had sent the individual wasn't abusing, although what
I said was offensive *with the swearing* but they appreciated my contacting
them on the matter."

I received no penalties from my isp because I hadn't done anything illegal
and it wasn't easy explaining to a techie about the intricity of a NWN2
module nor pretty much what I wrote here to you.

Its one thing to boot and ban someone because they were going to leave, but
quite frankly, they've been insulting, personally attacked me and they've
lied - even on your NWN2 Vault - about what I've done or said.

1) I've asked my ISP to keep track of any emails I have sent to their admin
(I've only sent one) not what their claiming I've sent out *Quote* All the
lovely emails you've sent us.

2) I never swore until the last day of my playtme on the game server. I was
really pissed off with one of the DM's who was running an event and never
bothered to state where the event was being held. I went to one of the lower
level areas to just kill things and passed a group and then got yelled at by
that same DM for "leapfrogging"

Basically I never knew the event was there and when I did, I backed right
off and literally had no part in it. I refused to be involved because I
entered the area unaware that it was being held there and I was angered that
I was being unjustly condemned by someone who went into a powerfit that I
was a bad person.

At the end of that event, he actually thanked me for not runing it for him.
Quite frankly, I wasn't interested after that display of hindsight. *Quote*
abusive to DM's, constant coarse language & obscenity.

On the note of coarse language too, Ignus Pyre, Mako and a few others -
WERE - literally wallowing in coarse language (in GM's presence) - so I do
not like being used as their scapegoat for swearing on my last day in
comparison to those players monthly/daily swearing monologues.

3) The last point - because you've blocked comments so I can't bring up the
others ad I can't recall those - was the harassment and bad behaviour. I
never harassed anyone in game. Jesus, I never even socialised with anyone. I
gave up after a month and only looked into groups from that point on,
because joining conversations was impossible because of their self-absorbed
attitude.

So I NEVER HARASSED ANYONE- the OPPOSITE actually (helping out people). As
to bad behaviour. That's roleplaying man. I was a duegar chaotic evil
rogue/cleric/deulist. And my guy naturally went about being sarcastic,
cynical and rude (partly from character nature - not to mention they were
never nice to his kind anyhow, and partly due to personality).

But I was never excessive or outright rude like "fuck off and don't touch
me." or anything like that. I was always subtle with what I said and most of
the time my guy said nothing - like i said, what's the point with THAT
community?

I believe that people should be aware of both sides of a private server.
Both the positive and the negative aspects. I admit that sundren has nice
maps and the roleplay is constant and intense (though very selective). The
XP gain was stable, and the areas were interesting. But there's also the
negative points which I've stated.

A lot of places - especially admins who can control what's said on sites and
comments - for the most part keep the positive and remove the negative
feedback. That, I believe is dishonest and manipulative.

But honestly, if that's the sort of server you want to publicise on your
website, then go ahead. I'm not stopping you, nor am I trying to change your
mind.

I'm just stating fact.

Originally I was going to just up and leave and he insulted me. Then I was
going to just put out feedback as to my bad experiences with the server -
just to caution people before heading head on like I had.

But again, he's proving that he has to embelish lies and false stories.

Of course he's changed that into something bigger with the personal attack
on my isp host, I will be making this legal because he's attacked me
personally.

BTW, just as a postnote. Blocking comments on their page isn't very
productive. People really do need to review both the good and the bad points
of the server and feedback is the best way of doing it.

------------------------------------------

might be an idea to keep the posts short. That was a long read. your saying he didn't read that email? Gawd.. if I'd read that, I'd at least have looked into it. Not what I'd call a professional write up but it didn't sound whiny either. You did tend to go off track a bit though, I lost the point on a few occasions.

You're obviously not a whining kid.

32 years old here and No, not a whining kid but I do hate not being heard. I believe I'm doing the public a service by giving both the good and the bad about that server. But like with online gaming, if someone in power hates you, then they'll do what they can to silence you.
Its the same with public reviews, like i said. *And like that NWN 2 admin stated himself* - they'll listen to the positive reviews but block comments to the negative reviews and personally I think that's just crap.

Your 32 and you still play games? O_O

yeah, I'm 32... i know people older than me who play games still too.

Just a minor update, I'd like to add. The nwn2 guy doesn't really give a shit. I'm certain now he didn't even bother reading the letter I wrote, because I got a response back to my email of;

-------------------------

last post: i'm not the only one who's had grief from them..

http://nwn2.warcry.com/forums/read/101.47960?p=1#372724

that's my final say..

--------------------------

was responded with;

--------------------------

Thanks. I've warned them about causing any more problems
on the site. If you want to re enable comments please let me know
or if they cause problems on any other submission, let me know as well.

--------------------------

in other words, the moron thinks I was the admin about the comment / " I wrote!"
Not the guy who was griefed by the assholes from that server.

Yeah thanx Maximus.. Love being labelled as a faceless individual. - jerk.

I have been watching this thread for a while, wondering how it was going to turn out. I've made one decision, I won't got near that sundren server. If its causing all this conflict, its best to avoid it.

Silly how some hosts can be of websites and servers where it comes to nobility and honor. I have experienced gamemasters like you described as well and they ruin the fun for a lot of players. But I AM shocked to hear about the neverwinter nights 2 vault experience. I thought the administrator was one of those people who would be good at making decisions and thought things out before replying.
Its a disappointment to hear one of the larger forum and online gaming servers for neverwinter is no different from other big webmaster hosts. I'm glad that there's other public sites for the game (and other games) around so we're not narrowed to the select few available.

I'll keep monitoring this thread, because I'm interested in seeing how it turns out. If wolfecub and you others are as honest as your saying you have been, I wish you the best of luck and make it to your goal. *wink*

I know the nwn2 vaults well. I surf through there for news and modules to play in but its nice to learn that the guy who runs it sees everyone within there as a number instead of a person. It won't stop me from viewing their content, but going by what you said and his email response with a flippant disregard to what you wrote to him, I certainly won't bother trying to get to know him - either.

They are more concerned about having a bigger and better site, rather than spending the time to actually filter out the bad nwn2 persistant world modules run by snot-nosed kids who have no understanding, responsibility or maturity. Long as it fills up space on their website to look great, that's all that really matters, right?...

Wolfecub:
yeah, I'm 32... i know people older than me who play games still too.

Just a minor update, I'd like to add. The nwn2 guy doesn't really give a shit. I'm certain now he didn't even bother reading the letter I wrote, because I got a response back to my email of;

-------------------------

last post: i'm not the only one who's had grief from them..

http://nwn2.warcry.com/forums/read/101.47960?p=1#372724

that's my final say..

--------------------------

was responded with;

--------------------------

Thanks. I've warned them about causing any more problems
on the site. If you want to re enable comments please let me know
or if they cause problems on any other submission, let me know as well.

--------------------------

in other words, the moron thinks I was the admin about the comment / " I wrote!"
Not the guy who was griefed by the assholes from that server.

Yeah thanx Maximus.. Love being labelled as a faceless individual. - jerk.

* * * *

LOL.. you're on a mission aren't ya?

Dude, taking on the sundren server is one thing but give up on trying to take down the nwn2 vaults website. You'll lose!

Still, I can't believe that the guy got you mixed up with the dick running that PW module. So yeah - he doesn't read mail or look into stuff, obviously. He may have to spend most of his time managing his own site, which I know can be time-consuming (had experience with it). But if he's forgotten who you are already in over a day then I'd say he plain doesn't give a shit as long as he continues being lost in his own world and his own website.

I wouldn't take on the NWN2 Vaults server tho man, cos you won't win.

Hi Candycane! 8-D

lil-lightnin:

* * * *

LOL.. you're on a mission aren't ya?

Dude, taking on the sundren server is one thing but give up on trying to take down the nwn2 vaults website. You'll lose!

Still, I can't believe that the guy got you mixed up with the dick running that PW module. So yeah - he doesn't read mail or look into stuff, obviously. He may have to spend most of his time managing his own site, which I know can be time-consuming (had experience with it). But if he's forgotten who you are already in over a day then I'd say he plain doesn't give a shit as long as he continues being lost in his own world and his own website.

I wouldn't take on the NWN2 Vaults server tho man, cos you won't win.

I'm not trying to take on the NWN2 Vaults website guy and I wasn't even attempting too. What I'm pissed about is that I put out an open book about my griefs, experience and giving an explanation of my ordeals. The guy couldn't give two shits.

The other thing is that the Sundren server rely mostly on the NWN2 vault to publicize their realm and the best place for me for people to read my experience was on that webhost since it is their primary "victim' magnet.

Of course with them removing comments so people like me or others can't advertise why that's not a healthy realm to join, then I've achieved nothing. I DON'T want people to go through the same fucking bullshit I went through and feel bad afterward.

The NWN2 Vaults guy plainly doesn't give a shit who those fuckheads hurt or how they treat players. In fact, because their allowing those fucks to hide the comments option only goes to prove that;

1) their taking no action to look into matters
2) they are ignoring a players comments on that particular server or even emails sent.
3) goes to show that they "LOVE" nice comments and will remove "NEGATIVE" comments if they feel its a justified statement/observation from the individual who sent it.
4) Free speech is a no no if it contains some well justified remarks - that are against any particular realm they host.
5) are a pack of self-centred cunts who turn their minds inward.

my main hatred to the NWN2 Vault site is basically - the guy doesn't allow opinions of players who want to write up any problems, conflicts or issues with a particular realm. He hides the bad and only shows the good.

That's fucking poor management-ship

Hi people.

I have played on Sundren once a long time ago. I liked the zones and the world set up, but the dms were mostly lazy and the players were up themselves. I saw that they welcomed some people and shunned others (it was very noticable.)
I felt alone a lot and lost interest in play on server because they did not make me feel welcome.
Sorry english not too good. Hope you understand me. Do not waste time on server, people ignore and make you not feel good.

Its starting to sound more and more like the server should be monitored. I agree that allowing an admin to continue to function on a public server when its obviously generating player complaints about treatment and then not taking any action on rectifying the problem - goes to show that the information supporting site, (in this case NWN2 Vaults), is turning a blind eye to player's reports upon a selected server and allowing it to continue at others' expenses.

I'm assuming you have sent him the link for here (I think you did with the post you did earlier) and he just ignored everything we've said too?

PS: Hi LL

Thread's gone rather quiet...

I reckon the final conclusion is:

a) Sundren.org server is a piece of shit and the admins are just whiny children.
b) It should be avoided and removed from hosting link sites.
c) NWN2 Vaults admin doesn't care about hosting PW's that are assholes - he'll host anyone without a care to the impact these PW's have on his website.

That sum it up about right?

Yep, that pretty much sums it up.. tho i would have said;

a) sundren.org is a cunt server, the admins are self-righteous cunts who don't like having their power undermined or told their wrong.
b) Anyone hosting that piece of shit should be fined and have a legal court write a removal of advertisement or face prison.
c) NWN2 Vaults host is an asshole who has a short-term memory and instead of protecting the community and feel concerned about what materials or whom he hosts, he's only thinking of the $$$ and not the possible problems some hosts may inflict on a certain community. - if he fucking thinks at all!

sums it up a little better I think.

Wow .
Those are all the same reasons I left that mod to ..( and that shit hole TFR )
I came across just about everything you guys said also .
( cept that gold stuff )
anyway
I did something about it and got my own mod .
LOA im sure some of you have heard of it ( its in the pw action server list )
and we get tons of folks, have a great time and even better staff .
I dont want to draw this out into some kinda advert, really .
Just wanted to invite you all to come check us out .

www.thelegendsofarcadia.com

The server is officially in beta, so things are going to get changed around on a regular basis.

Funny how the Sundren server has so many active players these days and only a handful different ones are posting here? Some of you banned I believe, I wonder why. Perhaps these things work both ways. A server admin who does this on his free time doesn't need to put up with abuse.

LOL Verrath. :)

Forums are always known for the grumblers. Carry on with your server. I'm sure it's terrific. :D